Bonus Chapter 2: Did Liu Yiqing Lie to Me?

Youth Forum of the Third Han Dynasty >> Xi'an Campus Network >> History Section

[Li Tao] Has the excavation of Tomb M589 and its surrounding tombs opened a new chapter in Wei-Jin Tianhan historiography? Has it also largely confirmed the authenticity of those anecdotes in *A New Account of Tales of the World*?

1L Original Poster

As the title suggests, we reject infighting and fan wars.

2L

sofa!

LZ, since you're posting in the history section, you should be more precise. With so many Han dynasties mentioned, who knows if you're referring to the Western Han, Eastern Han, Shu Han, Xiongnu Han, Later Han, Northern Han, the First, Second, and Third Han Empires of modern times, or the First, Second, and Third Republics of the modern era?

3L Sima Xiangxiang

It's already a new account of the world, so it can only go up to around 439 years ago, which is about 120 years into the Tianhan era.

4L

That's a pretty broad range. I think the story of composing a poem in seven steps is definitely fake. Emperor Wen of Wei's poems were rated as top-grade by Emperor Gaozu (Liu Jun), so how could he possibly give such a topic to his talented younger brother out of jealousy? Besides, that poem doesn't seem like it was written by the same person who wrote the Ode to the Goddess of the Luo River.

5L OP

The certification process is ridiculous, I think too.

6L I'm a big fan of the Xie family

I do think the description of Xie Daoyun as a woman of exceptional talent is true. Imagine, on a snowy day, the elegant and refined Xie Daoyun, along with the graceful and talented Xie Daoyun, gather around a stove to enjoy tea, admire the snow, and discuss philosophy...

7L Dugu Fuko

Just thinking about it makes one yearn for it.

8L I'm a big fan of the Xie family

Right, right? Judging from the epitaphs unearthed today, Xie Anlianweng and Xie Anshen have been confirmed to be real, so I think Yongxu is probably the same.

9L I love fair skin

Speaking of which, Xie Daoyun was almost ruined by Wang Ningzhi, that mediocre man from the Wang family. Fortunately, Emperor Xiaozong (Liu Jia), who loved to meddle since childhood, intervened and asked his uncle (Huan Wen) to recommend his clansman Huan Yi.

10L I'm waving the flag for the Xie family!

A famous general who wrote "Three Variations on Plum Blossom," a talented woman with the ability to compose poems on willow catkins—the couple were a perfect match, and just thinking about it makes me happy.

By the way, Huan Yi also has a famous story about singing while playing the zither with Grand Tutor Xie.

11L

Speaking of stories in Shishuo Xinyu, not to mention Emperor Gongzong (Liu Qin), who only reigned for a year, Emperor Gaozu and Emperor Xiaozong were really a big family. There must be seventy or eighty stories about them together.

12L I love cool-toned fair skin

They're really quite similar. Add to that the stories of other civil and military officials during their reigns, and it feels like most of the most fascinating parts of "A New Account of Tales of the World" are from these two dynasties.

13L Original Poster

Considering that the owner of M589 was very likely King Hyojong, otherwise we could shorten the title to something like "between Go and Hyojong"?

14L Dugu Fuzi

First, it has been confirmed that the story of Emperor Gaozu standing on the city tower playing the flute to repel the enemy is mostly a fabrication; the story is actually about Liu Kun, the Duke of Zhongmin, using a hujia (a type of reed pipe) to repel the enemy.

To be fair, Emperor Gaozu excelled in calligraphy, painting, and poetry, but his musicality was somewhat lacking.

15L = =

For some reason, I was personally taught the zither by Lord Zhongmin when I was young...

16L

I don't know if it was because of that musician named Xu Jing that caused a period of discord between father and son, and then there were all sorts of life-and-death separations and near-death experiences. How could he have the mood to be devoted to music?

17L Original Poster

Okay, let's use the flute to repel the enemy.

The next nomination is "A Thousand Pieces to Redeem Taijin." It tells the story of Wen Zhongwu's dissolute lifestyle, his fondness for gambling and prostitution, especially during his southern campaigns when he lingered in the glittering city of Jiankang, often forgetting to bring money and needing his friends to redeem him.

18L Wuli Anu Ya

I'm an international student and I don't really understand this story. Could someone please explain it to me?

19L Dugu Fuzi

I'm also an international student, but I know this story! It's about when Emperor Gaozu was still serving as Minister of Works in Chang'an. Wen Zhongwu spent the night at a courtesan's brothel, but when he went to settle the bill the next day, he realized he didn't have enough money. He sent his cousin, Emperor Gaozu, to redeem him. However, the courtesan, seeing Emperor Gaozu's handsome appearance, refused to release him even with money, insisting on having a night with him…

20L I love fair skin

Emperor Gaozu, a man of such high moral character, could not possibly agree. He wrote a poem to politely decline, yet pitied her tragic past and advised her to make plans for the future and reform herself. Moved by this, the courtesan straightened her clothes and respectfully saw Emperor Gaozu off.

21L = =

Looking through historical records, it only says that Taejin was a gambler, but it doesn't say much about his love for PC games. He and that woman who was involved in the scandal had a pretty good relationship, so I tend to think it's fake.

22L

So here's the question: Wen Gong's fan is also mentioned in Shi Shuo Xin Yu, and according to the unearthed epitaph, he only had two wives, Lady Li of Gaoping and Lady Wang of Langya. Which of his mothers was Lady Liu?

Is this story true or false?

23L

Anyway, the story about the fireworks market is definitely fake. Emperor Gaozu was already one of the Three Dukes at that time, so why not just send Marquis Lu directly?

24L I'm a big fan of the Xie family

It's not necessarily true... Letters were unearthed from the tomb. In them, Grand Tutor Xie instructed Emperor Xiaozong to be cautious in his words and deeds and to have refined tastes. Emperor Xiaozong retorted that when his grandfather was young, he was taken by Wen Gong to broaden his horizons, but he remained unmoved by temptations. Later, after experiencing various wars, when he went to redeem Wen Gong, the courtesan he had politely refused had ended up in Jiangdong and become a madam...

25L wuli Anuya

Wow! So pure love, yet so heartbreaking!

26L Original Poster

Well... if that's the case, then let's assume it's true. (A thousand pieces of gold to redeem Taejin)

27L Sima Xiangxiang

Then I'll nominate another one: the theory of "shooting the hidden object".

28L Dugu Fuko

Hmm, I don't remember this article very well. Can someone explain it to me?

25L = =

This looks fake at first glance.

26L.

In other words, after the empire was stabilized, the dispute over the succession arose again, but Emperor Gaozu managed to quell it with his prestige. However, at this time, many members of the Liu clan started causing trouble, claiming that the fiefdoms of the two kings and three retainers were better than those of the Liu clan members. Emperor Gaozu thought this made sense and decided to change the fiefdoms, but he was bound by his previous imperial pronouncements, so he used the Mid-Autumn Festival riddle-guessing game as an opportunity…

27L

This... seems a bit far-fetched.

28L.

It's hard to determine whether this is true or not, but after more than ten years on the throne, Emperor Gaozu did indeed carry out a large-scale reshuffling of fiefdoms. The two kings and three retainers almost all relinquished their fiefdoms and from then on only received honorary titles.

29L Sima Xiangxiang

For some reason, Sima Ye, the Prince of Chenliu, is always portrayed in history as a foolish beauty. This story is also fabricated to show that he was too stupid to figure it out, so he lost his fiefdom...

30L = =

To be honest, when Emperor Gaozu started his career, besides his cousins ​​and brothers, his closest friends were Liu Dan, who was enfeoffed as the Prince of Nanyang, Lu Jing, the loyal Marquis of Leping, his cousin Wen Qiao, the Duke of Qi, and the Prince of Chenliu.

31L.

Of all the last emperors of dynasties (although strictly speaking he doesn't count, but the Two Kings and Three Regents acknowledge him as such), none had a better fate than him.

32L

Besides, he had also been involved in a palace coup!

33L = =

Your Majesty, why have you rebelled?

34L I love fair skin

All I can say is that our Emperor Gaozu was far too dignified.

35L OP

I just searched the keywords and found that the King of Chenliu appeared in 70% of the stories in "A New Account of the Tales of Emperor Gaozu". I also searched the "Annals of Emperor Gaozu" and found that the King of Chenliu appeared 32 times in the form of "Emperor", "King" and "Chenliu", ranking first.

The original poster changed the title to "Li Tao, A Short Story about the Prince of Chenliu from the M589 Tomb?"

36L Original Poster

Welcome everyone to the new building for discussion.